07 Feb Episode #10: Laurie DiBiagio from Sirena + The Sea
Manifesting your dream business.
Today I’ll be talking to Laurie DiBiagio designer, and creator of sirena + the sea. Sirena + The Sea offers hand-sculpted and woven accessories. using natural, reclaimed, and refined materials that evoke the feminine spirit.
What we talked about:
- Finding life/work balance in a busy city.
- Being inspired by nature.
- The power of side projects.
- Transformations when you move from corporate to owning your own business.
- The power of manifesting.
After so many years of being a corporate artists and working in this controlled environment, I literally felt like an animal in the cage. I was a very rebellious, I liked to say I manifested getting fired
Words from Laurie:
Jennifer Dopazo: Hi Laurie, welcome to The Fabricant Way, thank you for being here and welcome, I’m so happy to talk to you today.
Laurie DiBiagio: Hi, thank you for having me.
Jennifer Dopazo: Before we start talking I want you to share the story of it. I want you to share what idea Sirena and the sea came to be.
Laurie DiBiagio: Okay, this is so interesting for me to like actually be here and speaking about my progress, my babies. It’s actually a really easy place to start so that’s great.
I moved out to the north shore of Oahu in 2010. I moved from New York City. I was living in the West Village at the time. I was a creative coordinator for the apparel showrooms at Ralph Lauren. I was living your typical New York existence. Actually lived on the same street in the West Village where they filmed Friends. I literally was working at Ralph Lauren and living across the street from that building. I was Rachel.
Jennifer Dopazo: I love that.
Laurie DiBiagio: I grew up loving Friends. When I moved to that street, it was Waverley, and my dad was like “Honey you’re really Rachel” I was like I know! I quickly got over being Rachel, hence moving to Hawaii. I actually moved there for love and a job, and I left without that job and without that boyfriend. That’s also an interesting story in and of itself.
I accepted a job before a moved there at Tiffany & Co, I was the visual merchandiser for 6 stores in the pacific. Two of the highest grossing stores in the company. Kaho’olawe and Waikiki and ones on outer islands, and also in Guam.
Long story short, after so many years of being a corporate artists and working in this controlled environment, I literally felt like an animal in the cage. I was a very rebellious, I liked to say I manifested getting fired. My boyfriend just asks me if I was late one to many times. Either way it’s the same thing.
Before I manifested getting fired, I literally just really started feeling this wasn’t me, this wasn’t right for me. Everything just started coming to a head. I was feeling really defeated as an artists while I was living in the most beautiful place in the world, in Hawaii. Literally 10 steps from the ocean in my own little blue crush paradise. I was suffocating as an artist.
I was going out to the big island for the weekend with my friend Nikki and her family and her son was turning one years old. We went out to the big island, as I said, and one year old birthday parties are a really big deal in Hawaii. Her families property, she’s part Hawaii, they have this amazing land on the big island. It was just spectacular. Waterfalls, acres. They were throwing an authentic luau with Imu it On the ground, and every bodies contributing. Shucking and the women were taking apart tea leaf leis and weaving them on there feet. I was watching, and it was all so beautiful, and sacred. I lived in Hawaii for over 2 years by then, it felt really good to be finally having a real authentic traditional experience.
My friend Nikki, she put the tea leaf lei over me. I had a turquoise necklace on, I just took it off, and I looked up at her and I said, “Fuck I want to make these, these are so awesome.” It was a moment of inception almost. Immediately that tea leaf lei went over my head, and it’s literally like a light turned on and my life changed. I started going from there, and that’s really the point where everything has evolved from.
Jennifer Dopazo: Oh, I love it. This is the story of transformation. So many things that we could just talk. I feel that that it’s something … I know, will come through somehow in different levels.
Laurie DiBiagio: Yeah.
Jennifer Dopazo: I love the whole … You manifested being fired? That’s something that I’ve never heard before. It was because you wanted them to make the decision for you?
Laurie DiBiagio: Huh. Manifested getting fired because I probably wanted to be able to collect unemployment so I could just fully focus to be completely honest if you want to be raw and real about it. No I’m just kidding.
I don’t know it was just … There was just so many things coming at me. It was such pivotal time when I look back at it. I think without getting fired, and without that wake up call, say I had quit my job and looked for another job, I probably would have done the responsible thing and said “okay I’m going to quit this job and get another job that I like.” I had known at that point that I had already done Ralph Lauren, and I had already done this. I had already been in the corporate world.
Since I was a little kid I’ve always had an authority complex. I hate people telling me what to do. I don’t respond to that, and I immediately rebel against it. I never saw myself being a lifer that way. I like to call the script, and to not be offensive to my friends and the people in my life who feel comfort in following that script, but that will never be and never was the way for me. I know I just needed something to kick my ass into high gear.
It had been a transition into them firing me. I know it took some time, and yes there were things that were my fault. Like being late. Apparently my dress was to bohemian for Tiffany & Co, we can go on for there. There were a lot of ethical things that I fought against that just weren’t right for me. Not even human resources lies, and the way the hierarchy and the way the people treat each other. Also on the massive amounts of waste, and the excess. It was so superficial, and so surfaced, that’s not who I am as a person. I guess at that moment it was just a door for me. I could go one way or the other, said I’m going to commit to my dreams and my life.
Actually, if you don’t mind me continuing to talk. This is actually a really great story. It was actually probably a couple weeks before I got fired. My friend Nikki who is an amazing talented designer, she was a big part of me starting my business and I had got into her apartment, and I was just so depleted and she looked at me and she said “You have no life you.” I was like “I Know I can’t continue to do this”
She told me you need to start this brand. I had already had been thinking about it prior to getting fired. You just need to go into this all by yourself. I had a long commute from the north shore. From town to the north shore, and vice versa. I was driving home, and I got home that day. I lived on this property with a bunch of other people. I said to one of my land mates there, “I can’t do this anymore. I need to be surfing, and making and designing and traveling and doing yoga, and meditating, These are what my days need to look like.” And he’s like “Aren’t you being a little dramatic” I just looked at him and thinking no i’m not.
That was a decision that I made when I got manifested getting fired. That I’m going to do this. Today, to this day, that’s what I’ve been doing ever since that moment.
Jennifer Dopazo: That’s awesome. I love the story, I can’t imagine how many people identify with it. I think we hear so much about the corporate world and living it, and pursuing your dreams, and your passion, which is not easy. You know that, you’ve built a business out of it. I also feel that it takes … You have to be brave to do it. That’s one thing, you can’t decide to quit your job, but also this is really hard. Making your own business.
Laurie DiBiagio: Yes.
Jennifer Dopazo: I think that just listening to you of all that things that were happening at that time. It seems like there were so many things happening from some different levels, and different people coming at you. Things that you were seeing and experiencing, and that it basically gave you a push to do it. I can’t imagine how many are just like nodding to your story.
Laurie DiBiagio: I think so. I do too. You know.
Jennifer Dopazo: What does the name Sirena and The Sea comes from?
Laurie DiBiagio: Huh. Okay, comes from a lot of things. I guess it all kind of reverts back to that moment of inception on the big island. I could really get spiritual here and deep. I don’t know how many people will relate to me on that level. I’m on a big believer in past lives, I knew I had lived in Hawaii before. I knew I was very connected to the ocean.
Sirena means mermaid in Italian and Portuguese and Spanish. I was sitting down just jotting things down by myself. Words I liked, colors, things that have always inspired me. I had Led Zeppelin song, The Ocean came on, and I just had been thinking, in the sea, and my friend Nikki, as I said, is a big proponent in pushing me forward to start this. When we were on the big island for her sons luau, she had stayed a few days later. We were kind of thinking about going into business together. She had stayed back, and she had to spend some time, and like I said, this is such a sacred piece of land, and her family being Hawaiian, we share a lot of the same beliefs.
She just said I had a vision of you coming out of the water. You’re so happy and sad, and naive, and curious. I also feel like you’re a kid pulling on my shirt, like look look look look at that. I had a vision of you as a mermaid coming out of the water. You’re not a [nu-sel 00:11:42], but you’re not from this world. It’s like you’re getting your legs for the first time. That just resonated with me so strongly.
Listening to the Led Zeppelin song and applying that story. I got to Sirena and The Sea. I guess it kind of tells a narrative about me and who I am. It was the root of it, it set the tone for me to tell this story about my life. I think a lot people just think that I’m a jewelry brand. They can’t see the vision that I have in my head going on and what I eventually see Sirena and The Sea being. It’s a never ending story.
Jennifer Dopazo: That’s something that I got, as I said before we jumped into the coal, I was reading your website before preparing for this and getting to know more about it. The way you just present this story you way you talk about it, it is not a jewelry brand. It is way bigger than that. I really love that, because it feels like it is … You can see what you’re going for. I can see how one of the pieces, if I get one and I wear it, that’s how I want to feel. That’s something that I want to bring with me. Which you’re presenting. I thought that was so beautiful and so brave. You don’t see that that often. There’s so many of them, how do you write about a company or a brand, it’s just a little bit more dry. The way that you present it’s just beautiful. You can tell that this, you can get closer to the story. You can see what’s behind it, what is it about.
Laurie DiBiagio: That means everything to me and the world to me. That’s exactly what I’m trying to communicate so I’m glad that’s … Sometimes you wonder, are people picking up on this are they understanding me to hear that confirmation is awesome.
Jennifer Dopazo: I’m sure like everything it’s not really for everybody, but I think that the people, maybe there’s something that the people who really resonate with it with are the ones are going to want one of the pieces and love it and preserve it, and just understand how special it is.
Laurie DiBiagio: It’s definitely not for everybody.
Jennifer Dopazo: Yeah, which takes me to my next question. You do have lines, you do have your collections. Each piece is special, because you handmade everything. It’s all made by you. It’s just you, were getting your work. Can you tell me … Share with us how is a day in your life? How does that work?
Laurie DiBiagio: Okay. A day in my life, as I said I started the business in Hawaii so it was a lot more tropical back then. Since then I’ve moved home to the Jersey Shore, where I was born and raised. It might not be Hawaii, I’m still close to the beach, and it’s still beautiful in it’s own way. Other than location, my day to day life hasn’t changed very much. I guess every day changes. I’d say on an average day, I normally wake up around 6:30. I put my coffee on, I have a little altar setup in my home. I grab my crystals, and my cards and my Palo Santo and I usually spend some time meditating, connecting for the day. Sometimes go watch the sunrise, sometimes surf, sometimes go to yoga. Usually flips between those few things.
Mornings are very sacred to me. I like to take the time for myself. I was never good at being on time to work because I like to do all these things. My day probably doesn’t start between 10, 12 in the afternoon. I normally, if I’m by myself, and I don’t have anything else going for the day, I’ll usually just power through till dinner time, and just keep on working. If lunch comes up with a friend, I’ll do that. Waves come up I’ll do that. My boyfriends a scallop fisherman, he’s out at sea a lot. If he comes home and he wants to go to Montauk and go to Bali, I’ll do that too.
I really use the philosophy of mine for my life to fit into my work. Not my work to fit into my life. I guess as I said, with my story, I am living. I’m living my work. I’m living my brand. I’m living Sirena, and part of that is enjoying life, and not feeling guilty about it. That’s why we’re here.
Jennifer Dopazo: I love that, because one of the things that … I love that it kept your rhythm You’re not living in Hawaii anymore, but you can still get that balance when you were there. One of the things that impress and really amaze me is when I moved to New York, was just how I even fell into it. The whole rush, and busy all the time, busy I don’t know about what, but it was just like no you’re busy. It’s like this constant state of mind that it’s kind of like these pride of being overworked and busy, and tired and overachieving. I love to hear that even though that you came back, you just maintained the way you wanted to keep working. I think I love that because it’s so easy to forget that, it is to fall into the rhythm that whatever the city or environment is going to give you.
It’s kind of like a fresh air, just amazing to hear you say that. That you go on your surf, do your meditation, take your sacred time for yourself. Which is something I know some people might feel guilty. Not spending time, working working, working. I think that at the end of the day, if we decide to have our own business that’s kind of the perk of it also. You have control over it.
Laurie DiBiagio: Yeah, I mean I can’t say that I don’t battle with a little bit of guilt when I walk away from it, I know how to separate myself from it, and it always gets done. Some days my Tuesdays are Saturday, and some days my Saturdays are a Tuesday. It’s just balancing, you have to be committed to it, when you have this freedom to do what you please you don’t have anybody telling you where to be, or what time to be there. You need to be dedicated to it, you need to make sure that you’re putting the time in, and you get out of it what you put into it.
Part of that work for me isn’t just constantly thinking I need to produce something like a lot of work that I’m doing is growing as a human being, and learning that yes while being an entrepreneur is hard work, and it’s not always easy. It doesn’t have to be hard. I think that’s a misconception that people often think that you need to be struggling. Believe I’ve done my fair shore of struggling and eating the ramen noodles. I lived in my friends shed for a year.
I’ve made the sacrifices. I think you use the power of manifestation and believe in it. You don’t necessarily have to go that route. I’m the story teller, I laugh at myself that I often think I chose it.
Jennifer Dopazo: Yeah. That’s wonderful.
Let’s take it back a little bit about … You do have your E commerce site. People can go to your website, they can purchase things. What’s that the first way that you got your clients? I kind of want to know, and see if you can share with us, those first clients, or orders. How did that happen?
Laurie DiBiagio: Like I said I was still in Hawaii when I launched the business. We had a trunk show down the street with my friend Erica Jaso, she’s an amazing yoga instructor, and a few other friends out there. They just put together a little trunk show. I can’t remember now if it was for somebodies birthday party. Just a lot of awesome women in one space and they all just ate it up. I sent my work back home and another friend of mine she represented it for me while I was all the way in Hawaii at a boutique named Red Moon which was the first store to ever take my work. So big shout out to Christina for that. She’s in Asbury Park. They sold it without me there it did super well. It just started evolving from there.
I had launched in June and had moved home at the end of August. Just slowly but surely doing a lot of shows around here. Putting myself out there, watching myself, disconnect from shows more and have more stores pick me up, and have more retail orders. It’s so awesome to see when people that you don’t know from all over the country are purchasing your work. I have to give a big shout out to my community around here, and the people that do support me, even though a lot of my transactions, there not through my E commerce, or even through the shows there. They’re Through people directly contacting me, people really like to get to the source, and go through the artists.
Jennifer Dopazo: That’s awesome. Yeah, how do you keep up, and this is just saying and I don’t work in retail or anything like that. It’s such a special product, everything’s handmade. It’s all about you. How do you keep up with these orders? Do you limit them? How do you go about that?
Laurie DiBiagio: I have a fine time keeping up with the orders. I haven’t really hit a point that I’ve felt super overwhelmed. It’s a really great steady pace for me. I feel comfortable. I like this pace because I’m still honing in on my craft. I’m still developing my product, developing myself as a person and my brand, and right now where I’m at and the projects that I’m getting it’s always serendipitous where I end up. I’m really selective abut where I go. It’s just important for me that’s it representative for my brand. It’s just awesome to see how it’s progressed, and how I’ve progressed. The pace is pretty awesome. I have some pretty exciting things coming up, I can’t talk about them.
Jennifer Dopazo: That’s awesome. I love it that you were in a process wise or business wise to have so much control over it. Which I love by the way. The first thing that I think of a business like this, what happens in seasons like holidays, or different seasons, it might be really really busy. It seems like you do have a great, you know how to take on it, everyone’s happy. It’s not to going to disrupt so much like your daily life is. That’s great to hear.
Laurie DiBiagio: Yeah. I had my first big order last April. I produced it for Terrain which is Anthropology’s little sister project. It’s their garden, and home space. I produced 150 pieces by hand. At first I didn’t think 150 pieces was that much, but with the kind of work that I do and every component of my work is handmade by me and solely by me, I realized wow, it was a lot of work and I went to art school. I was living on my friends property at the time. They have a son, and I lived in their little pool house. They were just watching me buzzing back and forth. They’re like you have not stopped for a week. I know between making this and prepping it and shipping it, and tagging it and handling this order. This is a lot.
Like I said, it’s been great for me that I’ve been able to set my tone and my progress at a pace that is attainable and keeping up with being … remaining an artist at the heart of it.
Jennifer Dopazo: And this comes … Like you mentioned you’re an artist, you went SCAD wasn’t it? What are you doing today? Is it something that you learned in college? Is it something happened after that? Those older scales just makes the pieces.
Laurie DiBiagio: Yeah, I’ve definitely shifted gears since college I guess, but at the same time I haven’t. Like I said, I think it was destiny, and I probably said manifested a few to many times in this podcast. My word of the day. I think I’ve been manifesting this since college. I was never a student, I guess I never applied myself. Like I said previously I’ve always had an authority complex, I’ve always disliked people telling me what to do, I was definitely rebellious in school. I never excelled in a traditional environment. I got to SCAD, I did my foundations courses, and I decided I wanted to major in interior design. Which at the time, my dad was always a business man who worked in New York City I think his parents and my aunts and uncles are very … They literally said to me that I shouldn’t have gone to art school. Why is she going to art school? She should be a teacher or a secretary or something like that.
My mom had gone to art school, I think that my dad, he saw that in me and embraced it and SCAD’s a really great school. I ended up there, majoring in interior design. I get into my interior design courses and I’m bombing. I’m doing terrible. It was the beginning of interior design is interior graphics. The program at SCAD is very architecturally based. It’s basically like load bearing walls without … It’s basically architecture, interior architecture with out load bearing laws, and physics and all that stuff. It was very technical and precise. I always excelled at the conceptual part. I remember my professor, she came up to me and she was like “What are you doing? You’re never going to make it, you do not have the skill set or the discipline to make it through interior design, you may as well just flunk it or drop it, because you’re going to flunk it.”
I remember she was in the air force, and she was intense, and she wore this low bun. I remember just looking at her and being like “Oh yeah, all right okay, I’ve been hearing this my whole life. So I’m just going to go at this hard.” And I did. Her and I became best friends by the end of my four years there. She was one of my biggest advocates. She was one of my biggest mentors. I remember being in my construction technology class. By this time, I had really started excelling. For the first time in my life getting straight A’s and not going to parties on Fridays and Saturday nights. Working, and so much passion for my projects. We worked our asses off in art school. We didn’t sleep for days at a time. I lived on Luna bars, and baked potatoes from Wendy’s I think at one point, and bananas.
I remember sitting in my construction technology class, not paying attention. As I said, I wasn’t into the technical side. I just started envisioning a brand. I knew that I always wanted to create one, I wasn’t sure what it looked like at the time, or what it was. I’m pretty sure that it revolved more around interior design, but here I am. I also always had a love for fibers. I remembered at that time that my professor wasn’t going to make it in between wanting to prove her wrong. Also I was exploring fibers, and I had gone to my dad and I had said to him “Dad I think I want to drop my major and go for fibers.” He said, “Well there’s no money in fibers, stick to interior design.” I laugh now because here I am doing fibers.
Jennifer Dopazo: That’s such a good story. What do you say is the biggest lesson you’ve learned from all this?
Laurie DiBiagio: The biggest lesson that I’ve learned?
Jennifer Dopazo: So far.
Laurie DiBiagio: Is to let go. Yes, to let go and trust the process. To be easier on myself, and to trust the process. Every time I get myself worked up, being an entrepreneur and being an artists, it’s not always easy, as I said. You still have to survive, you still have to keep your head above water. It’s not a consistent paycheck like you get when you are working for a corporation. Money comes in, money goes out, money comes in at one chunk, then money doesn’t come in for a few weeks. Then it comes in, then it comes out. You just have to learn to flow with it. I think I’ve gotten a lot better at not getting myself so worked up. The most important thing at the end of the day is not how much money I’ve made, it’s how much time I spent into beveling myself, and growing myself, and growing my product. Being in the studio and making is the number one thing. The more I make, the more opportunities the universe provides me with. I know that’s not the easiest idea for people to adopt, just letting go and trusting in the star. It’s pretty much what I do and its been working for me.
Jennifer Dopazo: Yeah, that sounds great.
Laurie DiBiagio: Yeah.
Jennifer Dopazo: Why do we need Sirena and The Sea in our lives?
Laurie DiBiagio: All right. Why?
As you said you picked up from my website, it’s not just a product, its a story, and a spirit. Sometimes when you’re someone following your dreams, it’s easy for you to say to people quit your job. Quit this and just go ahead and do it. They look at you and cross their eyes and think as I said that’s easy for you. I guess the way that I’m telling my story and the way I’m representing myself and my brand, yes it’s to show the world that I can do it, but at the end of the day it’s really not. It’s really to remind other people that I’m no special than them. I don’t have a trait that they don’t. I’m not genetically predisposed to do this, this is available to everybody. I guess my product and my story and my brand and myself as a human as a reminder and inspiration for people to do whatever it is that is in their heart. I hope when people head over to my website or touch my product or see it they feel inspired to follow their own compass and do what makes them happy. That’s why I think people need Sirena and The sea.
Jennifer Dopazo: Yeah, definitely. When we were saying that I mentioning your story and your website, even the images you’re using on your website, it’s just that it doesn’t come as oh this person has it all figured out. Of course you had to figure it out and it’s amazing what she’s doing. There’s this whole thing … You can feel easily that we can get to know you just by reading it and spending a couple of minutes on your website and learning more about it ad looking at the products. That’s something again as I said it’s so hard to get maladaise sometimes with so many products.
I was having a conversation earlier with Paul whose also going to be on the podcast, he was saying something on the same lines. There’s no perfection, just enjoy it, really believe in it and just do it from the kindness of your heart. People pick up on that. You can definitely see that in your brand and your products.
Laurie DiBiagio: Yeah.
Jennifer Dopazo: I know you said have there’s a lot coming up, and some things that you kind of shared. Is there anything coming up that you want to share with us.
Laurie DiBiagio: Well, something top secret that I can’t tell, but you will find out about it eventually. Which is something that’s so exciting for me because this is really the heart of where Sirena initially started for me. Two years later … Again I’m manifesting.
I am working on a new collection of jewelry right now. As I said I really want my brand to evolve to be me and my lifestyle in tangible form in all product categories. Right now the focus is jewelry, I’ve put out a few collections now in my 2.5 years. While I’m happy with them all, when you start out you need to make your presence known. You need to define who you are to some extent, not totally.
Because we’re always evolving. I feel like all of my collections while I’m proud
of them and I think I’ve put out a great unique product. I feel like I always finish … There’s always something I could have changed or could have done better. I feel like I rushed the process a lot of times for myself. I feel like finally I have enough out and established my presence enough that I can take my time at this moment. I am working on a new collection called the Lemuria collection, it’s telling the story of my past life in Lemuria which is they say is a mythical land, but I don’t believe it. It overtook Hawaii to New Zealand and I’m retelling the story of that life, and myself in that life through these jewelry pieces that I’m working on.
It’s going to be rooted in my core materials that I’m working for now. It’s definitely going to be still recognizable in the native and tribal influences, the very textual and organic shapes. I’m going to be looking different to everyone so I’m really excited to share that.
Jennifer Dopazo: That’s beautiful, I love it. Can’t wait to see it.
It’s been great having you, and this conversation is so delightful. Is there any sort of tip or advice that you would give to anyone who, you know maybe they’re listening to you and they feel like an animal in a cage in that job and they really would love go pursue their passion, or that side hustle they might be working on. Or they are having one of those hard days as an entrepreneur and be like this is hard I don’t know if I’m going to make it. It is there any advice, or tip that you might want to share with them?
Laurie DiBiagio: Don’t listen to anybody else but yourself. Yeah, no matter what anybody says, do what is in your heart. Go with the process, be patient, take your time. Go all in. Whatever that means for you. Everyone different, for me going all in meant going all in to the life I wanted to create. That artist designer surfer, yogi, meditator traveler. Going to a part time job that doesn’t feed my soul, doesn’t suffice for me. I’d rather be in my space everyday, and if that works for somebody else, then you do that. Fully commit, fully trust the process, trust the universe. Trust yourself, it wouldn’t exist in you if you weren’t meant to have it. We’re all meant to live in abundance and prosperity, it’s not a right that someone deserves over another person. It’s a birthright of everyone, know it’s a birthright to follow your dreams and live in abundance in a beautiful life, then yeah.
Jennifer Dopazo: Love it, thank you so much, again it was such a pleasure having you and I cannot to wait for everyone just to get to know Sirena and The Sea, and follow you on Instagram which is just like go on your website and really see what’s behind the brand and just get to know you a little bit more.
Laurie DiBiagio: Thank you so much for having me, it’s awesome. This is like my first podcast interview. It’s a little bit surreal. Why does anybody care what I have to say? But yeah! Ha-ha it’s awesome.
Jennifer Dopazo: I’m so glad, of course everyone cares. That’s kind of the idea of this. I find it so fascinating, so many people doing beautiful artwork or products that it’s … For me it’s I always want to know the story behind everything> I realize I’m not the only one who wants to know that. That’s what it’s about, it’s about sharing your story and just letting people know about it.
Laurie DiBiagio: Yes. Being humble, that’s another thing. Now I’m being humble through the process is important to me.
Jennifer Dopazo: Thank you.
Laurie DiBiagio: Thank you.